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Topic: The Great Vanilla Revival Initiative: Discussion

Please use this topic to discuss the topic The Great Vanilla Revival Initiative so that updates can be seen more easily!

Please make sure to read the original thread before replying.

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Re: The Great Vanilla Revival Initiative: Discussion

That's a good idea, nice call smile
Though, true long message tongue
What about having official teeworlds vanilla server? For example 3 vanilla servers beginner, medium, pro.
I think it would be great to have some official Tournament, this would make the community more participative.

Need a tool to manage your servers? teeman
<3

3 (edited by yemDX 2013-11-25 20:56:05)

Re: The Great Vanilla Revival Initiative: Discussion

I'll play vanilla again if 0.6.3 / 0.7.0 is released before Christmas.

(Reviving something is easier when there's something actually news-worthy to post about, such as a new version.)

Ex-King of Teeworlds

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Re: The Great Vanilla Revival Initiative: Discussion

floyd wrote:

That's a good idea, nice call smile
Though, true long message tongue
What about having official teeworlds vanilla server? For example 3 vanilla servers beginner, medium, pro.
I think it would be great to have some official Tournament, this would make the community more participative.

I understand your suggestion, but I don't think it would help to have "official" servers. There have been admins hosting Teeworlds servers for 6+ years and players organized nicely. The same goes for having an "official" tournament. We have had many tournaments, organized differently (through ESL, some TW initiatives, etc) and they worked well. The problem is finding people to organize and maybe to comment the games as they are streamed like TeeTV did in the past.

yemDX wrote:

I'll play vanilla again if 0.6.3 / 0.7.0 is released before Christmas.
(Reviving something is easier when there's something actually news-worthy to post about, such as a new version.)

A new version, if released so soon, would not bring new gameplay features (aside from Last Man Standing gametype which is already available as a mod). A new version for the sake of a new version is not going to solve anything, since the problem has nothing to do with versions but with new blood, and it has been a problem that started stacking up back then when the Vanilla community was alive and kicking.

Now, I am obviously hoping we will release new versions sooner than later; that we will have new official gametypes; that we will have new maps, new features, and everything. We are also working towards that end. Yet I believe it's not only the developers that have to motivate the players, but the other way around. Now I'd really like if we could avoid skeptical replies and think positively.

Mostly, my call is not to individual players, even if I want to reach to them. I'm trying to reach other Teeworlds communities (ctf5, instagib, ddr, ...) and clans of the said communities to tell them: "I guess you like challenge, like all gamers? Well here's one for you, and we will help you getting started."

So, in response to you both, I don't think this is about having more involvement of the Teeworlds.com / TW dev teams, but rather having more involvement from the community, and the community helping each other revive the original game (that still has the characteristics we love it for, and that won't change anytime soon, new versions or not)... There are now 1000+ players on TW, less than 200 on random standard servers, 10 on what we used to call the "vanilla community".

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Re: The Great Vanilla Revival Initiative: Discussion

Hello Magnet!


Really nice post, I agree and support the initiative, not much I could add on the content though.

Now this really needs some more exposure that an English post on the forum. It would be really awesome if anyone could at least translate it in German, to spread the word on other discussion places. You would have all my thanks.

I'm sure this could be exposed to a lot of mod communities that just don't come and browse here.


Again, was a nice read!

Not Luck, Just Magic.

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Re: The Great Vanilla Revival Initiative: Discussion

Magnet wrote:

I understand your suggestion, but I don't think it would help to have "official" servers. There have been admins hosting Teeworlds servers for 6+ years and players organized nicely. The same goes for having an "official" tournament. We have had many tournaments, organized differently (through ESL, some TW initiatives, etc) and they worked well. The problem is finding people to organize and maybe to comment the games as they are streamed like TeeTV did in the past.

Well the goal of official servers could be something for newcomers, for example first time they connect in game, they already have the prompt for nickname, but they could have also displayed the beginner server. They would be advised to log there at first to discover the universe.

What about to implement also a "trusted server" list? This would make players more confident. These servers would just be a place to gather easily, displayed in the server list with a special flag/color.

About tournaments, yes I suppose it's hard to find people to organize and comment, but to me it's a bit what you ask in your initiative? You say that it worked in the past, so let's try to find people to organize this, there are some, but it needs more ads on the website.

Well just a few ideas smile

Need a tool to manage your servers? teeman
<3

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Re: The Great Vanilla Revival Initiative: Discussion

Good old vanilla memories sad

Qi - high level gaming
qi.m0g.net

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Re: The Great Vanilla Revival Initiative: Discussion

@floyd
I understand your point, I really do and I appreciate your message. We have thought about the features you talked about, including server levels, trusted server list, etc. But please do not hijack this thread and have it become a discussion about game features... There are other threads about how to help Vanilla by improving the client.

Before having tournaments, we need people to play them. Once again, this not a thread to start a discussion. This is a thread to ask people who are playing mods other than vanilla  (and their clans) or ctf5 players (who are only playing ctf5 as if it was a mod) to consider joining, and allowing those who want to help and those who need help to meet. It is meant to educate people about the current state of affairs. It is what it is: a call to reach through the scattered community, the Teeworlds diaspora... and meet in the promised Land of Vanilla. Oh wait, that doesn't end well wink

@Steph
Good memories, sure, but we can live new ones. The Golden Age is long gone, how about starting a Platinum Age? smile Let's think positively!

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Re: The Great Vanilla Revival Initiative: Discussion

Magnet wrote:

@floyd
I understand your point, I really do and I appreciate your message. We have thought about the features you talked about, including server levels, trusted server list, etc. But please do not hijack this thread and have it become a discussion about game features... There are other threads about how to help Vanilla by improving the client.

Before having tournaments, we need people to play them. Once again, this not a thread to start a discussion. This is a thread to ask people who are playing mods other than vanilla  (and their clans) or ctf5 players (who are only playing ctf5 as if it was a mod) to consider joining, and allowing those who want to help and those who need help to meet. It is meant to educate people about the current state of affairs. It is what it is: a call to reach through the scattered community, the Teeworlds diaspora... and meet in the promised Land of Vanilla. Oh wait, that doesn't end well wink

OK sorry, it wasn't meant to be a hijack or whatever. It was not all about "features". Specific servers wouldn't be a feature but just a place to gather, and why not to make people discover something else than ctf5 or ctf2, since there is not only ctf5 afficionados ... The same goes with tournament, not a feature, just a gathering.
Well to me this post is meant to have answers, you can't say "relay this" and not expect answers about how to gather the community, just my opinion, it's not June 18th and we won't go to UK without some talks, actions wink
Voilà, last time I "hijacked" this thread, good luck smile

Need a tool to manage your servers? teeman
<3

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Re: The Great Vanilla Revival Initiative: Discussion

@floyd, np, that's why I gave a list of servers in my original thread. I understand your point. We could keep that list in a topic until we can make a "recommended servers" feature in a future version. We have a bunch of ideas about that. I don't want to prevent you from expressing yourself, especially when considering that you're yourself an oldschool ctf5 player and one of the few who actually made a semi-competitive clan over there wink. I am just wary that more people start diverging and that the thread transforms into a wishlist for TW 0.7 wink. In any case, I hope you can relay the original message to whichever community you play in now (since I haven't seen you on ctf5 for ages, and you seem to be still around!). Cheers!

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Re: The Great Vanilla Revival Initiative: Discussion

LMAO, it's quite hard to read everything, but you wrote it O_O

On the other hand, I felt that I want to come play vanilla now sad Damn, you are manipulating me sad

12 (edited by Broken 2013-11-26 03:27:48)

Re: The Great Vanilla Revival Initiative: Discussion

Things that turned me off to organized vanilla games:

     Pros are extremely unfriendly and don't care about lesser skilled players. There is no mid-level scene and pros will act like anyone less skilled is worthless. So the game becomes completely ego driven. It's okay to have "star" players but not where they discourage people interested in taking up the game. And if pros play with lesser players they either insult or rage, instead of offering helpful tips or encouragement.

Some solutions that would work for me:

    A mod with daily automatic tournaments. This has helped in many other games I've played. One nice thing is, with a knockout structure, you always have a chance to be on fire for one day, or that a top player might not be playing. Also a mod with a form of skill rating, such as ELO. This lets you know what to expect and gives even the weakest players motivation to improve their rating and not be frustrated losing to a very high rated player. Lastly, for pros not to be complete fags.

    So basically I think the death of vanilla is entirely predictable, and players like me that have kept going on in spite of every reason to quit, are going to be rare. One mistake the devs have made in my opinion, is not realizing that TW, despite looking kid-fun-friendly, is actually a 100% skill based game, like chess or tennis. What we're hearing here is just, I think, the few straggling super pros left, that remember the cool "pro" days, and are sad most pros got bored of it. That's not enough for a "revival" of vanilla.

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Re: The Great Vanilla Revival Initiative: Discussion

Magnet wrote:

Before having tournaments, we need people to play them.

A tournament (well advertised) would bring more players than this topic on teeworlds.com.
How many donations are left on our for-teeworlds-master-servers-cash-account?
Take donations again and set up a tournament with prize money AND POOF 200 players more.

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Re: The Great Vanilla Revival Initiative: Discussion

Dune wrote:

It would be really awesome if anyone could at least translate it in German, to spread the word on other discussion places. You would have all my thanks.Again, was a nice read!

I can translate this post to German, but I don't have any accounts on other teeworlds community websites and I don't intend to create those. I can send you the translated post as a pm or per mail if you want, so you can post it onther websites.

15 (edited by 2013-11-26 17:18:24)

Re: The Great Vanilla Revival Initiative: Discussion

Broken wrote:

Pros are extremely unfriendly and don't care about lesser skilled players. There is no mid-level scene and pros will act like anyone less skilled is worthless. So the game becomes completely ego driven. It's okay to have "star" players but not where they discourage people interested in taking up the game. And if pros play with lesser players they either insult or rage, instead of offering helpful tips or encouragement.

I agree with your sentiment, but I believe I addressed this issue in my post. It's easy to put the blame on "pros" (which are partly responsible) but the fact is, mid-level players rarely try to organize in clans and get servers. You know, like "pros" did before they became "pros". We started like any one else, at mid-level. The only thing we had for us is the absence of "pros" but we hosted our servers, organized games, etc. I'm calling not one individual player to do that, but players who have shown the sufficient energy before (Instagib players are organized in clans, DDRacers or map makers spend a lot of time in Teeworlds, etc) to do the same.

Obviously there is a lot of bad attitude in the high-level community, but it comes mostly from two things:

  • These days many of the few "new pros" overcame the difficulty to reach a correct level and to do so, they had an arrogant behavior from the start. There is a correlation with the core personality and the outcome because of the current dryness in the scene. A few years back, when the pro scene started, we had a much wider variety of personalities, of people, coming from many more origins and the atmosphere was far friendlier.

  • Among some of us, there was a lot of second-degree (like saying "easy game" after a particularly hard/close game). This used to be mean tongue-in-cheek, but newer players who have copied us mean it with hatred and arrogance.

  • As I said, Teeworlds is not fun with big level differences between players. If there are high-level players available, they're gonna have priority because a mid-level player either as a teammate or an opponent is rarely fun for anyone.

Now, you're on a different timezone with a transatlantic ping, I think Teeworlds is too ping-sensitive for having cross-continental communities, so I don't think you could have "made" it anyway (there are a few exceptions, but however hard they try they can never match low-pingers, so I believe we should just have different communities).

Broken wrote:

A mod with daily automatic tournaments. This has helped in many other games I've played. One nice thing is, with a knockout structure, you always have a chance to be on fire for one day, or that a top player might not be playing. Also a mod with a form of skill rating, such as ELO. This lets you know what to expect and gives even the weakest players motivation to improve their rating and not be frustrated losing to a very high rated player. Lastly, for pros not to be complete fags.

These are in-game features that have been discussed (and are still discussed), they will help, and I hope we can implement them soon, but people are supposedly able to self-organize. Obviously many games now provide this kind of organisation and it's pretty cool, but we're just not there yet.

Broken wrote:

So basically I think the death of vanilla is entirely predictable, and players like me that have kept going on in spite of every reason to quit, are going to be rare. One mistake the devs have made in my opinion, is not realizing that TW, despite looking kid-fun-friendly, is actually a 100% skill based game, like chess or tennis. What we're hearing here is just, I think, the few straggling super pros left, that remember the cool "pro" days, and are sad most pros got bored of it. That's not enough for a "revival" of vanilla.

I believe you misunderstood me. I'm not asking mid-level Teeworlds players to join pro-servers. I'm telling them to play Vanilla on their servers, and I'm proposing we support them in the move. It looks like your own bitterness is talking, I'd really want to avoid this kind of argument. I'm calling for a new community, a reboot, where the 2000 regular Teeworlds players can resume playing Teeworlds without being harassed by high-level players until they are ready and we can unite, to have in the end a community finally spanning from mid-level to the highest levels, rather than starting at high-level and going to uberpro (many high-level players also feel they have no chance against a few select Godlike players).

Slayer *gV* wrote:

A tournament (well advertised) would bring more players than this topic on teeworlds.com.
How many donations are left on our for-teeworlds-master-servers-cash-account?
Take donations again and set up a tournament with prize money AND POOF 200 players more.

Hi Slayer, I know you have some community-related ideas and I agree with most of them, but who will be those 200 players? Do you mean that streaming the tournament will motivate more players to start Teeworlds? If so, what happens when they realize there is no mid-level Vanilla community to play in? I think we should be ready to welcome them.
Would these 200 players be from other mods, coming for the cash? Because that would be a very bad experience for them to join without practice. Do you think they would start to practice first? What chance would they have to win a prize, and would they realize that some pro team will get it? Unless pro clans are forbidden from taking part in the tournament?
Or would it attract old players, who would be gone again the day after for the same reasons?

I love tournaments and I think we should have some, but anyone can organize them (including you smile). We could help tournament makers to fund the tournament, if we all give 5€. I don't know if we can get money from the donate fund, since it will serve to pay for the official servers costs for a few years now.

What we need most is energy and motivation, to make those tournaments happen, to make new maps, etc. I believe this energy exists in Teeworlds but is spent mostly in mods. I keep my point that we need a realization to happen to other Teeworlds player and hope they will heed my call.

ghost wrote:

I can translate this post to German, but I don't have any accounts on other teeworlds community websites and I don't intend to create those. I can send you the translated post as a pm or per mail if you want, so you can post it onther websites.

First, a translation would be good then we can think of the hosting/posting details smile

16 (edited by Slayer *gV* 2013-11-26 20:01:16)

Re: The Great Vanilla Revival Initiative: Discussion

Magnet wrote:

Hi Slayer, I know you have some community-related ideas and I agree with most of them, but who will be those 200 players? Do you mean that streaming the tournament will motivate more players to start Teeworlds? If so, what happens when they realize there is no mid-level Vanilla community to play in? I think we should be ready to welcome them.
Would these 200 players be from other mods, coming for the cash? Because that would be a very bad experience for them to join without practice. Do you think they would start to practice first? What chance would they have to win a prize, and would they realize that some pro team will get it? Unless pro clans are forbidden from taking part in the tournament?
Or would it attract old players, who would be gone again the day after for the same reasons?

I love tournaments and I think we should have some, but anyone can organize them (including you smile). We could help tournament makers to fund the tournament, if we all give 5€. I don't know if we can get money from the donate fund, since it will serve to pay for the official servers costs for a few years now.

What we need most in energy and motivation, to make those tournaments happen, to make new maps, etc. I believe this energy exists in Teeworlds but is spent mostly in mods. I keep my point that we need a realization to happen to other Teeworlds player and hope they will heed my call.

Teeworlds, as each esport titel (yes, in my opinion teeworlds is one), raises and dies with its challenges. Tournaments are a good way for organized, funny and (semi-)official skill comparison.

In these days, teeworlds lacks of high level/ professional players and, like You pointed out, mid level players. People start playing vanilla teeworlds, don't see any sense of fighting and playing it (like: "Wow, i can beat 50% of this server full of beginners...but who cares?") and stop playing teeworlds, or join more rewarding modifications like Instagib or DDRace.

At this stage we should give them any reason to keep on playing vanilla teeworlds. When there was an active vanilla scene, there were many fun-/clanwars/capgames. Players were motivated to train there skills to take part.

Tournaments will fill this gap:
1) Old players are mostly very busy (out of school). Tournaments with fixed date and time give them a chance to reorganize their everyday life to take part. It is very demotivating to run teeworlds, looking for a non-existing high level game and shutdown teeworlds again.

2) New players would have a real reason to keep teeworlds playing. An active community and tournament szene are the most important thing in the life of a skill based game.

3) Tournaments (and VODs by casters) are the best way to advertise a game. Streamers will attract future-player over their platforms (they should have one).
Money is just a simple trick to attract them. wink


@Donations: GIVE US THE DONATE BUTTON BACK!
Open a new account for the donations and organize monthly tournaments (I am pretty sure we will find some casters, hosts and moderators for these games) with prices (1st: 50€, 2nd: 15€, 3rd: teeworlds server for the next month...whatever).
For higher motivation, integrate a chart on teeworlds.com and maybe also in the game (server browser), where you announce the recent top 5.


PS: I would love to help organizing tournaments and stuff, but after my exams (end of 2013).

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Re: The Great Vanilla Revival Initiative: Discussion

@Slayer, works for me. I remember that one of the reasons the donate button was removed is that Paypal is evil. Does anyone know any good donation organisation? We have to be honest about funding and say this is tournament funding. We could start a Teeworlds.com Tournaments donation fund. That's a good idea.

Then, I suppose we could setup a Twitch channel for broadcasting. But who would be actually broadcasting? It takes some bandwidth so you cannot play at the same time. Also, in the past, Somerunce had made a pretty cool TeeTV client (for 0.5.0) with in-game statistics like in football games and zoom-out. TeeTV sanctioned servers were patched so to give access to the full playing area to that specific client (the code is pretty simple, we could make it).

However, I'm not sure about players having a more rewarding experience in Instagib or DDRace. What is the incentive, besides being the best, and why is it also not an incentive in Vanilla?

If you can compose a tournament organization team, that would be great. But it should be some new people, I guess the usual suspects (SushiTee, Sonix, etc) are too busy and many of us would want to take part rather than organize (both can be done, except playing+broadcasting as it kills the bandwidth).

I think early 2014 is not a bad time frame, but it would be nice to get some things ready by then (a team, a website for ladders maybe? etc). You seem to have some ideas about it so if you can find other people to support you it could be a successful opportunity and help us tremendously.

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Re: The Great Vanilla Revival Initiative: Discussion

(I didn't read any post on here before because tl;dr, so sorry if this has already been discussed)

To be honest.. The reason why vanilla is dying are the players, which display an incredible arrogance.
I've experienced this by myself. I have been playing Instagib for like 1 year and wanted to change to Vanilla. Pinkie Pie from OtH convinced me to try it out. "It will be fun!" he said. Yeah.. As soon as I started playing Vanilla, I was told being an "Instagib noob, I should get skill". At capgames I didn't even have the chance to play with those old-school guys. (I wonder why. It's all the same, if they play vs. the same enemies). Btw, I am not including OtH, when I was playing with them, they have been nice all the time, regardless if I played bad or good. Sadly that clan died.)

I am VERY sure others have experienced that too. If you want your project be successful, tell your oldschool mates to stop being so arrogant and let the new players play, no matter if they were Instagib players or Block players.


For 0.7, you guys should review modifications and after a complete review decide, if those mods should be playable on 0.7 or not. This would get rid of MANY blocker servers, which are like 70% of the current servers. 90% of them containing maps like blmap_v3. (worst blockermap ever, sorry to say that). Also I do not have anything against block, I just wanted to clarify that blmap is a really bad map, if you want to improve your hook/hammer skills.

Please notice that this is an OPINION. I experienced that all by myself.

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Re: The Great Vanilla Revival Initiative: Discussion

xFrozen, it has been discussed, and if you read the post you would have seen that the proposal is not to get people to play against those experienced players unless that's what they want, but to help them start a new mid/high Vanilla community where they can enjoy the gametype without being harassed. As you say, you're not including OtH? Well there are other normal people in vanilla, so it would be nice not to put everyone in the same bag.

Anyway it is a general feeling so you are probably right it is among the reasons high-level vanilla couldn't get new blood in the first place. But it wasn't always like that.

But really, this has been discussed, and it is addressed early in my post. I get it. But this is off-topic since the proposal is not to mix newcomers and the current community, at least until things are evened out.


Honestly, the post is long, but if you don't read it, I don't see how your reply can be on target.

20 (edited by Slayer *gV* 2013-11-26 22:39:45)

Re: The Great Vanilla Revival Initiative: Discussion

Magnet wrote:

However, I'm not sure about players having a more rewarding experience in Instagib or DDRace. What is the incentive, besides being the best, and why is it also not an incentive in Vanilla?

They have a working community, vanilla doesn't.

Magnet wrote:

But who would be actually broadcasting? It takes some bandwidth so you cannot play at the same time.

Broadcasters can take part in tournaments, they have just to skip the games they are playing in. E.g: 1vs1 with 32 players = 16 (15 streamed) first rounds, 8 (7 streamed) second rounds, 4 (3 or 4, if he is out) third...

Magnet wrote:

Also, in the past, Somerunce had made a pretty cool TeeTV client (for 0.5.0) with in-game statistics like in football games and zoom-out.

If you want to take Teeworlds to the next (tournament-ready) level, those functions are needed urgently:
- spectator only slots
- better streaming features (mostly statistics, zoom)
- and for sure many other features you will be missing when you stream your first match

Magnet wrote:

If you can compose a tournament organization team, that would be great.

My contact list is very limited. We could at least open some threads to get some help.

Magnet wrote:

Does anyone know any good donation organisation?

There are many things that have become outdated, out of the game and ingame. We should consult other developer, team members and the community (via new threads) to discuss several things like donation, new streaming functions and support for tournament organization.

From my point of view: Only few player follow teeworlds.com. Implement a news window into the server browser, to reach the whole community.


Edit: and xFrozen, please don't reply to a thread you didn't read. This is no discussion about the bad behaviour of some vanilla high level players (there is no need, it is a fact). Also we won't forbid any mods but if we do, we will forbid all.

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Re: The Great Vanilla Revival Initiative: Discussion

@Slayer
The Instagib community has shrunk as well, so I'm not sure they have a working community, but DDRace sure does. But you told me before they had a something to look for as a reward (comparing to tournaments), that was my question... because for me, it's the same as in Vanilla.

About Teeworlds code improvements, if by "spectator only slots" you mean more slots, this is unlikely to happen anytime soon, since 16 is a hard limit used for various optimizations. We need one player with one of the server slots to be streaming.

Zoom out is already available for spectators in SushiPack, and so are stats, but the TeeTV client was better suited at streaming. While I hope we can have server-side stats in 0.7, I don't think an UI appropriate to streaming will end-up in an official Teeworlds release though.

Feel free to start a thread to gather interested parties. Also, I'm not sure about the news in the server browser. We are not trying to make things more centralized, but we will see where things lead us to. I know few players follow TW.com, but those who do are active on other forums & websites and can relay some news.

Also (unrelated to your answer particularly), these complaints about the attitude of some in the Vanilla community got me thinking. First, even among us Vanilla players, we find many players have a terrible attitude, but that's not stopping us from playing. Then there are players with terrible attitude everywhere, including in Instagib and DDRace. But most of all, there are tons of servers and server providers so nothing is stopping anyone from taking control of the situation.

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Re: The Great Vanilla Revival Initiative: Discussion

ghost wrote:
Dune wrote:

It would be really awesome if anyone could at least translate it in German, to spread the word on other discussion places. You would have all my thanks.Again, was a nice read!

I can translate this post to German, but I don't have any accounts on other teeworlds community websites and I don't intend to create those. I can send you the translated post as a pm or per mail if you want, so you can post it onther websites.


I posted it already on teeworlds-friends.de imo the biggest community after tw.com if you want Mag i could collect what they are saying and write it here down for ya

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Re: The Great Vanilla Revival Initiative: Discussion

I have translated the post into german, but I am not completely sure, if i got everything correct. I also was not able to come up with a good german version of the small poem. You can find the post here. I would greatly appreciate it, if anybody else could read through it and and improve it, before it get's posted on other websites.

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Re: The Great Vanilla Revival Initiative: Discussion

Hosting an official teeworlds vanilla tournament and using modificated clients for streaming is very odd, isn't it?

Magnet wrote:

The Instagib community has shrunk as well, so I'm not sure they have a working community, but DDRace sure does. But you told me before they had a something to look for as a reward (comparing to tournaments), that was my question... because for me, it's the same as in Vanilla.

DDRace and Instagib are both easy to learn (maybe hard to master). Vanilla is hard to learn, I would even say harder to learn than actually to "master" (comparison to the current ctf5 level).

Magnet wrote:

Feel free to start a thread to gather interested parties. Also, I'm not sure about the news in the server browser. We are not trying to make things more centralized, but we will see where things lead us to. I know few players follow TW.com, but those who do are active on other forums & websites and can relay some news.

How many players can I address when starting a thread here? 5? Maybe 10?
A server-browser news with "New official vanilla tournament looking for staff" has way more potential. You could also link a thread on tw.com.

Furthermore when trying to change something, waiting for the time to change things will lead to nothing.


@Jambi* How many active accounts does teeworlds-friends.de have?

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Re: The Great Vanilla Revival Initiative: Discussion

@Jambi
OK I'll have a look myself at those comments.

@Ghost
Thanks smile

@Slayer
I don't think it would be odd. One size doesn't fit all. We could make an alternate 'official' client for streaming.

Really I don't know about adding news in the TW client and in any case that would have to wait for a new major version that is not bound to happen that soon.

Solving the problem will require both short & long terms solutions. The long term solutions can include the various ideas we've had for code improvements, but I think we should get started on the reboot before new versions so that when we release something, there already are some people. Everytime there is a time lapse where most mods haven't been adapted to the new version, and there is the novelty of new official maps, so people tend to stay a bit more on vanilla. Well it would be far better if there were a mid-level community back then to enjoy it.