326 (edited by IcyPRO 2015-08-21 11:46:31)

Re: Teeworlds on Steam

Listen to this man guys @mechodownload, don't ignore what he's saying. He's absolutely right.
Just by throwing this game on Steam you can't expect long-term success! I've seen it with so many games. They get their own few weeks of attention and then they are long forgotten.

ALSO, just because this game is free, doesn't necessarily mean it's a good idea. If the game is free to play and it doesn't even have some kind of in-game shop to earn some revenue, it can't develop further, since there's no one who can work on it as a full-time job for free.

And honestly, I don't care what do you think or say, 5€ for this awesome game wouldn't kill anyone.
(But first, for a competitive multiplayer game account system IS A MUST! That's the least you should add to the game before you put it up on Steam = official servers, account system with rankings and levels, badges, rewards and possibly achievements.)

Also, people on Steam pay much more attention to bought games than to free ones.
- When someone buys a game, he wants to get most out of it. So then he reads some ratings, watch some videos beforehand, etc.
- While if it's free, he won't appreciate the game at all and probably uninstalls the game after one ragequit.
(Payed games also get much more attention from Steam itself. If you're a bestseller after a release or after you put up a discount and you get on that 1st spot, you will get so much attention from the Steam community all over the world or maybe even from Youtubers, which is really a big thing!)

You guys will only have one chance. Only one. And this game has one of the largest potentials out there.
So please think twice before doing anything...

327

Re: Teeworlds on Steam

IcyPRO wrote:

And honestly, I don't care what do you think or say, 5€ for this awesome game wouldn't kill anyone.
(But first, for a competitive multiplayer game account system IS A MUST! That's the least you should add to the game before you put it up on Steam = official servers, account system with rankings and levels, badges, rewards and possibly achievements.)

There's a huge step from a free game to a game that costs anything. I guess Teeworlds will always be free.

We should definitely consider the other points mechodownload mentions!

328

Re: Teeworlds on Steam

Teeworlds is free! if not i go to work on release it free big_smile
For me it would disregard the selfless work of many people who helped thinking that it would always be free.

329 (edited by IcyPRO 2015-08-21 14:50:37)

Re: Teeworlds on Steam

unsigned char* wrote:

Teeworlds is free! if not i go to work on release it free big_smile

Says a lot about you actually...

I personally would want to pay for this game 5€ and it wouldn't seem too much for me at all, as long as I would see that the game is developing and getting regular updates that makes it even better.

Try to understand, asking money for a game that was once free may enrage you, but if you see a bigger picture in the future you would be thankful that they ever made that decision. (And it's not like they would ask money for the same exact game that was once free, but a game that would include exciting new features when arriving on Steam - at least that's what I expected when they announced Teeworlds arrival on Steam.)

Of course I don't want Teeworlds developer team to make a cashgrab out of their game, just give it some value, so that they can hire a team that could push the game forward. If you don't get it, then I don't know what else should I say.

330 (edited by unsigned char* 2015-08-21 15:35:28)

Re: Teeworlds on Steam

Emm.... in the past teeworlds has a donation system... I and many others pay anonymously...
https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/30566237/imgs/pago_tw.png

If you get money... who gets it? 2 lines of code = 0,10cents? more ppl works free but only few gets money?

I can understand pay for server maintenance... but in open-source for "developing best" ummm no... i think that can be worst for that purpose. hmm

331

Re: Teeworlds on Steam

Lol, where did the donation button go big_smile?

I'd prefer if there was some kind of donation button on steam and on the website again and that people would know how much they have got to donate in order for it to be more than the fees paypal takes. Or maybe some bitcoin donation wallet.

Teeworlds[ friends ] clan
Some YouTube Stuff about Teeworlds

332

Re: Teeworlds on Steam

jxsl13 wrote:

Lol, where did the donation button go big_smile?

I believe it was removed because we collected more than enough money to maintain servers on the long run. That's the only thing Teeworlds needs money for.

Not Luck, Just Magic.

333 (edited by IcyPRO 2015-08-21 17:01:56)

Re: Teeworlds on Steam

If you get money... who gets it? 2 lines of code = 0,10cents? more ppl works free but only few gets money?

I can understand pay for server maintenance... but in open-source for "developing best" ummm no... i think that can be worst for that purpose. hmm

The fact it's open-source is nice, good for modders (and hackers) but MODS ARE NOT official part of the game.
Money would go to the official developers, that would have some certain goals with the game progress, not to the community.

Take Don't Starve as an example:
We get regular official content updates (which they can afford to do since they EARNED something of the game), even though it's pretty much 90% open-source game. And thanks to that there can be bunch of mods that make the game even more fun, but those modders don't get a cent for their work. They did it as a fans, because they enjoy playing the game and want to make it even better than it is.

But without the official game progress, without the updates, news and all that stuff the game won't be known for long and will get back to it's previous state at which it is right now.

If developers are fine with that, then so be it...

334

Re: Teeworlds on Steam

Teeworlds is open source and will always be.
With this in mind, I hardly see how you want to sell the game.

Not Luck, Just Magic.

335

Re: Teeworlds on Steam

Dune wrote:

Teeworlds is open source and will always be.
With this in mind, I hardly see how you want to sell the game.

GNU wrote:

Many people believe that the spirit of the GNU Project is that you should not charge money for distributing copies of software, or that you should charge as little as possible—just enough to cover the cost. This is a misunderstanding.

Actually, we encourage people who redistribute free software to charge as much as they wish or can. If a license does not permit users to make copies and sell them, it is a nonfree license. If this seems surprising to you, please read on.

The word “free” has two legitimate general meanings; it can refer either to freedom or to price. When we speak of “free software”, we're talking about freedom, not price. (Think of “free speech”, not “free beer”.) Specifically, it means that a user is free to run the program, change the program, and redistribute the program with or without changes.

Free programs are sometimes distributed gratis, and sometimes for a substantial price. Often the same program is available in both ways from different places. The program is free regardless of the price, because users have freedom in using it.

Nonfree programs are usually sold for a high price, but sometimes a store will give you a copy at no charge. That doesn't make it free software, though. Price or no price, the program is nonfree because its users are denied freedom.

Since free software is not a matter of price, a low price doesn't make the software free, or even closer to free. So if you are redistributing copies of free software, you might as well charge a substantial fee and make some money. Redistributing free software is a good and legitimate activity; if you do it, you might as well make a profit from it.

Free software is a community project, and everyone who depends on it ought to look for ways to contribute to building the community. For a distributor, the way to do this is to give a part of the profit to free software development projects or to the Free Software Foundation. This way you can advance the world of free software.

Distributing free software is an opportunity to raise funds for development. Don't waste it!

Click me or don't. I know you will.

Follow, and I lead xp

336

Re: Teeworlds on Steam

Netherland wrote:
Dune wrote:

Teeworlds is open source and will always be.
With this in mind, I hardly see how you want to sell the game.

.. GNU quote ..

Click me or don't. I know you will.

This is always brought up in discussions like this and I believe it has little value. Tell me a business model that involves selling free software. It doesn't work. The first user that buys your product is can just to release its source for free, or provide the product for a lower price. Just because it's not illegal to sell free software doesn't mean it's actually useful (at least for end-user software such as Teeworlds).

But all that doesn't matter! Teeworlds will remain free both as in beer and as in speech.

337

Re: Teeworlds on Steam

heinrich5991 wrote:

...Tell me a business model that involves selling free software....

For example, Odoo ERP: https://www.odoo.com/apps

** All modules uses AGPL license.

338

Re: Teeworlds on Steam

The warning has been given. Their fate is now their own.

339

Re: Teeworlds on Steam

IcyPRO wrote:

The warning has been given. Their fate is now their own.

I think it is not completely clear that making Teeworlds cost money will actually benefit it.
If somebody acutally paid for a product and he still dislikes it, he will more likely write a bad rating. This will not happen as often if nobody actually charges for the game. In this case most people will just think "I don't like the game, but I didn't paid for it, so I don't care".
Games with bad reputation will not be successful on Steam. The better Teeworlds is rated, the more people will likely play it.

Loving TW since 2010 smile

340

Re: Teeworlds on Steam

JonastheRoman wrote:
IcyPRO wrote:

The warning has been given. Their fate is now their own.

I think it is not completely clear that making Teeworlds cost money will actually benefit it.
If somebody acutally paid for a product and he still dislikes it, he will more likely write a bad rating. This will not happen as often if nobody actually charges for the game. In this case most people will just think "I don't like the game, but I didn't paid for it, so I don't care".
Games with bad reputation will not be successful on Steam. The better Teeworlds is rated, the more people will likely play it.

Sry but wrong, i now ppl with business and they tell me that if you sell a product 20 € more ppl got to say that something is wrong/bad... if you sell the same product 65€ far fewer people will complain, remain exactly the same product. It is illogical but it happens so wink


For me the problem is the goal... "best develop" who? Oy? but Teeworlds aren't made only by Oy... anybody can work to make Teeworlds best... perhaps the question is other....

341

Re: Teeworlds on Steam

unsigned char* wrote:

Sry but wrong, i now ppl with business and they tell me that if you sell a product 20 € more ppl got to say that something is wrong/bad... if you sell the same product 65€ far fewer people will complain, remain exactly the same product. It is illogical but it happens so wink


For me the problem is the goal... "best develop" who? Oy? but Teeworlds aren't made only by Oy... anybody can work to make Teeworlds best... perhaps the question is other....

You are right with your example, but I think when a product is relatively cheap (like Teeworlds would be), people would just give it a try. When a product is expensive, like in your example, many people would only buy it, if they are already convinced of the product BEFORE they bought it, so after the purchase also less people will complain. They also perceive the product as a higher-quality one. But you couldn't charge that much for a game like TW.
On Steam, on the pages of cheap games, many of the negative reviews say "even those few bucks were too much for this game". That's why I am afraid that selling Teeworlds could reduce it's Steam reputation.

You are right about the point with the developers. There are many people who only contribute occasionally, how do you want to deal with those contributions, if you were going to pay the coders?

But the discussion is fairly senseless anyway, as Teeworlds will stay free no matter what. smile

Loving TW since 2010 smile

342

Re: Teeworlds on Steam

Just popped in to apologize for my absence and unreasonableness/unable to work with people/blahblahblah.

It seems you all are doing fine, that's nice. The beauty of being part of a functional video game community...
It was fun working with you while I was up for it Oblique big_smile

//mechodownload you have some pretty boss ideas there if you ask me.

I used to be a heck of dork here...
But then a great Moderator exclaimed how I appear: "Kirby, you're inexperienced in social ways"
So to myself, I say... "Hey, I'll be around," And thus the true Kirbs, was righteously found. (after much time and experience elsewhere)